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Which medic primary do you use?


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Poll: Medic Primaries (64 member(s) have cast votes)

Which is your favorite/ most used primary?

  1. Crusader's Crossbow (21 votes [32.81%])

    Percentage of vote: 32.81%

  2. Stock Syringe Gun (19 votes [29.69%])

    Percentage of vote: 29.69%

  3. Overdose (11 votes [17.19%])

    Percentage of vote: 17.19%

  4. Blutsauger (13 votes [20.31%])

    Percentage of vote: 20.31%

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#1 Savage

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Posted 07 July 2013 - 05:37 PM

Choices: Syringe GunCrusader's CrossbowOverdoseBlutsauger

 

Keep in mind that my perspective is that of a 6v6 competitive medic.

 

Personally, I don't think the xBow is a good choice. It's a lot of fun, and can lead to some awesome frag/distance heal videos if you have accuracy, but in terms of defending yourself from a scout when you're alone, it's just not as good as the needle guns. 

 

In a similar vein, it takes a special kind of medic to use the Blutsauger effectively. Passive health regen. is an attribute completely unique to the medic, so you have to be careful of limiting it so severely. There are some great competitive medics that use it well, but for most people I wouldn't recommend it. Health packs should actually be saved for your teammates when you can't heal everyone at once. They shouldn't be used to heal a medic who has taken spam that s/he shouldn't have. (Obviously if you need the pack, you need the pack).

 

In competitive TF2, you'll see some medics using xBow and a few with the Blut, but many will choose the Overdose (some like me use stock). Here's why I don't think the overdose is a good choice:

 

Let's pretend that the base medic primary has none of the advantages of stock or the Overdose. You get to choose: +10% damage, or +x% speed increase while the overdose is equipped, where x is 1/10th your uber percentage.

 

Both of the advantages of the two guns only work when they're equipped. If you think about when you're going to be using your primary, most often you will be alone, trying to escape and enemy. "AHA!" you say, "surely I choose speed then. If escape is my goal, I want to move as quickly as possible!"

 

Well, sure, speed is nice, but in 6v6, who are your opponents, again? Oh, right, the three fastest classes in the game, two of which also have nice speedy projectiles. Even with the maximum speed addition of the overdose, you will not outrun a scout or a well-placed rocket.

 

Furthermore, you should never be taking advantage of the full 10% speed boost anyway! If you have 100% uber, you should use that to escape. And if you have more than 75% uber, it's probably less risky to try for the ubersaw than it is to try to run.

 

Personally I'd rather have the extra damage with each needle. A nice burst of needles can be very discouraging to a chasing enemy.

 

In short, the benefits of the overdose are not as applicable as people think, and having a bit of extra damage in your needles is probably more useful.

 


Edited by Savage, 07 July 2013 - 07:46 PM.


#2 Drake

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Posted 07 July 2013 - 08:49 PM

I'm 50/50, Overdose / Crusader's Crossbow. Overdose when I expect alot of close-range engagements, Crossbow when I can keep distance.

 

I used to use the overdose pretty exclusively (and I lead gameMe in Overdose kills, so I use it more than I would like to admit  :sad: ). It could be all the scout that I play, but I felt like I was surviving and escaping better with the extra speed. Yes, there is a dmg penalty, and if a Demo/Scout/Soldier really commits to chasing you, you're not running away easy. But most of the time, I use the speed boost to move and dodge more effectively when I'm being fired at. I won't always take on attackers, but usually the movement speed helps me dodge attacks/fake movement/kite better. Movement speed advantage is in how you use it, be it running away, maneuvering better while fighting, catching up to teammates, etc. I use the speed boost more for engagements then I do just running away. I've never played comp medic outside of TF2lobby, but I usually prioritize survival over my defensive damage output. Though dmg output can be deterring. 

 

For scouts, the damage is weaker, but if you're actively building, your speed goes up to a max of 16% under theirs. By all means, if I have a uber, I'm gonna save myself. But if I'm running any of the other 3 mediguns, or don't have someone immediately near me to use my uber on, I usually have to scrap a bit to survive. Being able to match scout's speed more easily can make fending him off easier. Might just be all the scout I play, but I feel more comfortable shooting and dodging at higher speeds. I usually have the mentality of "If he can't hit me, he can't kill me. Use the speed to not get hit".

 

I've started to use the Xbow alot more recently though. It's definitely poor at point-blank defense, but it's pretty good at mid-range support. Once you get used to the accuracy, 70 dmg arrows and 80+ heals are nothing to laugh at, especially with the reload speed. I've saved alot of jumpers and people out of my immediate range with it. The burst heals of the arrows have definitely been a time saver for me when there's a lot of dmg going out quickly. When you're in triage mode, shoot a heavily damaged person who needs heals, immediately swap back to medigun, and overheal/move on. One less person you have to worry about saving.


Edited by Drake, 08 July 2013 - 01:24 AM.

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#3 Slink!

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Posted 07 July 2013 - 09:13 PM

I use the crusaders crossbow most of the time... The distance heal can be usefull while i am running to the aid and i can heal most of the damage before getting in medi-gun range. But I would use the syringe gun for a more combat medic role (which I never do).


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#4 ulver

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Posted 07 July 2013 - 09:21 PM

Stock if running uber. Crossbow if I have amputator for the extra self-heals and am running krtiz.


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#5 perplexingPariah

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Posted 07 July 2013 - 10:02 PM

Back when I wasn't in any community, I used to love the Xbow/Amputator set because I loved the extra regen bonus of +4 health per second. I've always hated Pyros' afterburn (-6 hp/sec) so I only lost -2 hp/sec. I also liked being able to provide quick heals at a distance as well as scoring some nice sniper!Medic kills heh. 

 

Then I started to use the Bluts for some strange reason and switched my melee out to the Ubersaw. I really like the health gain on hit but realized that I didn't think it was worth the -2 regen (again for Pyro afterburn and general health regen because then survivability would be low in a very spammy soldier/demo heavy environment)

 

When I started discovering that TF2 has a competitive side, I was torn between the Overdose and stock but this was my train of thought that made me ultimately decide Overdose:

 

At 100% ubercharge, the Medic would run at 107%+10%=117%

A Scout runs at 133% so it really wouldn't be too much if a decent Scout was the one chasing you down.

However, if it was any other class in tight corners, I doubt they would be able to do much as the third fastest classes are at 100% (so you would have a +17% advantage if you're simply running away). Now if you're in a very open map with a taller sky box, Sollies/Demos can jump/bomb but your speed will make a long distance attempts more difficult. 

Now, we have to note that most the time Medics pull out their syringe guns when someone is chasing them so they're probably running backwards with your front to the enemy chasing you down. With this new information, we know that a Medic at 100% ubercharge will run backwards at 106% which is a +6% advantage to the 100% classes except Scouts. 

So is the Overdose worth it?

In my opinion, I think speed is definitely something that can be taken advantage of so yes. The -10% damage penalty means that you're just taking away 1 dmg (9 instead of 10) The stock provides no additional bonus except that +1 dmg and let's face it, you could be backpedaling at 96% with the stock while a Pyro could be W+M1ing you at a full 100%. (The 96% would make you the fourth slowest class!) With the Overdose, you could match the Pyro's forward running speed at even just 40% ubercharge and stay out of the flames' range. I mean realistically, I'm sure more veteran Pyros would utilize their secondaries (Shotty/Flare/etc) to nullify the Medic's avoidance of their flames but still, an advantage is an advantage.

 

I am an Overdose Medic. :)


Edited by perplexingPariah, 07 July 2013 - 10:07 PM.

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#6 Carl

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Posted 07 July 2013 - 10:16 PM

Crossbow all the way.  Default needles are the smartest choice - they are the safest and provide the most damage if you are retreating / fighting off one class.  But the crossbow is so much more fun.  And at the end of the day I play this game to enjoy myself.  If that comes at a slight expense than so be it.


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#7 Lucienbel

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Posted 07 July 2013 - 11:42 PM

I overdose myself, for the added speed others have mentioned.



#8 farenheit4.5.1

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Posted 08 July 2013 - 02:12 AM

I typically use the crusader's crossbow, amputator, and basic medigun for the health regen it grants you. I find that this regen can be really useful in combat, especially when countering afterburn or bleeding. 



#9 Penvellyn

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Posted 08 July 2013 - 03:13 AM

I use the Blutsauger only because I have a strange one so I figured I might as well do something with it.



#10 Eltomato

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Posted 08 July 2013 - 06:07 AM

I have always used the xbow because when I'm close to enemies I find it more worth-while to go in with my ubersaw than my needle gun (I have bad aim with needles, not used to them, and I like being able to gain uber/hit) and I've always thought the overdose isn't a big enough speed boost to really make much of a difference. After reading Pariah's post however I'm definitely seeing the advantages of the overdose, especially in comp where there's no ubersaw crits. If I ever played comp highlander I think I'd use the overdose, but not for 6s. In 6v6 you have demos, soldiers, and scouts, all classes that can catch you anyway with the speed boost, so I'd rather have the stock for more damage I think.


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#11 Eisotopius

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Posted 08 July 2013 - 06:31 AM

I've always hated Pyros' afterburn 

Note to self: Dodge rockets, destroy FaN, burn Pariah.

~~~

I use Stock syringe only because I have a strange version of it, I suck at aim with the Crossbow and I don't have an Overdose.

Should probably start using the Crossbow.


Edited by Eisotopius, 08 July 2013 - 06:34 AM.

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#12 perplexingPariah

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Posted 08 July 2013 - 07:59 AM

I do use the Bluts when I'm MedicvMedic with needles only lulz. 


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#13 54321StickMan

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Posted 08 July 2013 - 11:58 AM

I use the xbow/amputator for the extra health regen. The xbow is also useful fo healing rocket jumping soldiers that get up high or far away players, which is why i like it. If it just doesnt work in the game, i use stock.



#14 Gustav Holst

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Posted 08 July 2013 - 06:22 PM

I've tried blutsauger, and the -2 health per second regen is a huge problem when you bide your time instead of finding health.  I've tried to use Overdose on the premise that I can outrun spies, but more often than not I need the crossbow to heal someone across the map, or make a sniper rethink his positioning.  Plus, I can't aim needles for shit. :P


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#15 Gulfen

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Posted 08 July 2013 - 06:25 PM

Syringe Gun because medic is the best pick class in the game.


Edited by Gulfen, 08 July 2013 - 06:27 PM.


#16 Bpt17

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Posted 08 July 2013 - 07:13 PM

Blutslager For close range combat.



#17 Savage

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Posted 08 July 2013 - 10:42 PM

@Gulfen

Syringe Gun because medic is the best pick class in the game.

 

It's also quite good at taking out sentries due to the needles' arc. Basically, no one should play any class but medic.



#18 Gulfen

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Posted 08 July 2013 - 10:45 PM

@Savage
We need a return of TFC medics.

#19 Vampyrelord13

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Posted 11 July 2013 - 03:02 PM

Stock ALL THE WAY! I went with overdose for awhile, but in all honesty it's only "useful" if your healing a scout and you should never do that! There are so many other classes to heal!



#20 Savage

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Posted 11 July 2013 - 04:20 PM

I went with overdose for awhile, but in all honesty it's only "useful" if your healing a scout

 

What.

 

your healing a scout and you should never do that!

 

Doublewhat.

 

The overdose's effect is entirely independent of who you  are healing. And yes, scouts need heals too (especially overheals, and it takes about 1 sec to completely buff them).